Constructii pe Marte? Viata pe Marte?

[DepthOfField]

o chestie:
Acuzam NASA, americanii etc ca mint cu totii, ca misiunile curente sunt de fatada, ca trebuie si ei (cercetatorii) sa traiasca si sa-si justifice bugetele uriase alocate, ca musamalizeaza vestigii extraterestre sau aparitii UFO pe orbite etc

Sa lasam un pic fundalul complicat la o parte. Sa vedem lucrurile la baza lor. Omenirea trimite pe Marte, (si in cosmos in general) niste nave automate, se chinuie extraordinar pentru asta (ca bani, tehnologie de varf si raport scazut reusita/esec, precum si ca numar de misiuni, ba mai sunt si pierderi de vieti omenesti - vezi Columbia, Chalenger si multe altele). Si nu oricine poate sa faca asta, ci natiunile cu cei mai multi bani. Bun. Astea sa zicem ca ar fi faptele chiar reale. Acuma, este chiar greu de crezut ca apar astfel de opinii si mistere? Ca se ridica intrebari si suspiciuni? Ca NASA pare sau chiar nu raspunde unor provocari din media sau "popor"? in fond orice constructie, orice realizare, orice "casa a Poporului", orice "turn eiffel", orice vila cu doua etaje in orasul tau etc etc sau orice alta intreprindere umana isi are si oponentii ei. Oameni care se opun. Care nu cred "explicatiile oficiale". Cum ar fi angajatul fata de directorul cel mare al intreprinderii la care lucrezi, si care ia niste decizii, si oricat de competent ar fi, tot vor fi oameni care sa se opuna sau sa nege. Intotdeauna se vor gasi oameni care vor comenta. Care vor nega. Care vor cere explicatii si care le vor refuza ca atare. Si altii care vor propune propriile lor teorii si explicatii cu privire la ceea ce se vede sau ceea ce se intreprinde. Unii chiar au dreptate, altii nu. Unii au ceva de castigat. Altii au incredere oarba in propriile lor convingeri. Sa dam exemplul acestui forum sau ce alt forum vreti: diversitate de opinii sau pareri in legatura cu acelasi fenomen sau produs. Pentru ca asta este natura umana, si ceea ce vedem este reflectarea propriei noastre naturi. Cei care lucrati la un servici si aveti relatii profesionale cu alti colegi sau clienti, stiti bine ca intotdeauna apar aceleasi lucruri pe care le descriu aici: celalalt minte, celalalt a gresit si musai ascunde ceva, celalalt e incompetent, celalalt (sefu') ia decizii eronate si da explicatii gresite, exista informatii la care nu ai acces (de ex ce salariu au ceilalti sau bugetul companiei) si nu poti decat sa dai cu presupusu (deci te poti insela si judeca gresit lucrurile) etc etc. La baza sta subiectivismul datorat lipsei de informare si lipsei viziunii in ansamblu a unei chestiuni sau fenomen, precum si propria cultura si inteligenta. E ca si cum nu ai vedea lumea decat printr-un geam stramb, deformat si fumuriu si ai cauta sa intelegi ce frumoase sunt florile in lipsa de informatii suficiente pentru a le putea intelege. Acest fenomen al neincrederii,  si al propriei pareri subiective (si inerent nu neaparat corecta), se repeta la orice scara: vecini, colectiv, tara, umanitate.
Deci dupa parerea mea, este extrem de logic ceea ce se intampla: chiar daca NASA pur si simplu este o entitate ce simbolizeaza curiozitatea omenirii despre cosmos, oricum se vor gasi criticieni si oamenii se vor intreba: "de ce asa, de ce nu asa, de ce nu a facut aia, de ce nu a zis ailalta etc etc.
Aaaaaa, ca si in NASA, care e facuta din oameni, apar probleme, greseli, coruptie, falsuri etc, tot ce se poate. E la fel ca si in intreprinderea unde lucrezi sau in guvernul in tara in care traiesti. Unii falsifica facturi. Sau vand marfa expirata. Altii falsifica voturi. Altii spun ca fac programe sociale si-si fac vile etc. Si unii si altii vor sa ajunga sefi si/sau sa scape de munca urata. Suntem oameni cu totii. Iar cei dovediti ca calca stramb, jos cu ei. dar astea sunt alte probleme.

Dreamy, ai spus:

"vei observa din fotografiile pe care NASA ni le flutura pe la nas ca avem deja 2 "TAXIURI" pe Marte...ce-i drept transporta bolovani si praf martian, nu oameni....treaba cea mai interesanta este ca nu aceste "taxiuri" in care s-au investit o garamada de tehnologie si verzisori, transmit cele mai interesante imagini ale planetei rosii, ci tot amaratii aia de
sateliti!!!"

Pai amaratii aia de sateliti sunt la fel de high-tech si sunt o altfel de "unealta" care isi are propria ei valoare (nu ne place la toti Google Earth? ce sa mai vorbim de domeniul militar, ca de aici a pornit totul...). Cat despre robotei... ce pot face ei mai mult decat au facut?
Bun, daca tu sau eu trimitem niste robotei pe Marte, si nu ma refer la a 'nspe mia misiune de rutina, ci iata misiuni unicat si in premiera pentru omenire, ce crezi ca ai putea da restului lumii? ce ai gasi si ce ai afisa? De ce te miri ca pozele roboteilor martieni ar fi .. neinteresante? Ce ar trebui sa fie si ce trebuia sa faca NASA ca sa "ne ia ochii"? (sau chiar ar trebui sa ne ia ochii?) Si mai important..ce va zice lumea? Daca eu, ca entitate oficiala, ma duc in Padurea Baciu si nu gasesc mare lucru...in acelasi stil vor apare intrebarile: dar nu ai cautat indeajuns..dar de ce nu ai facut poze de noapte? dar de ce nu te-ai dus in padurea vecina? Cum explici cutare chestie? Cumva ascunzi nu stiu ce? etc etc.

Ai mai spus:

"Intrebarea care decurge firesc....de ce nu au trimis robotii sa cerceteze zonele cele mai interesante ale planetei, sa faca fotografii la fata locului ...cred ca nu are rost sa mai spun despre ce imaginii si locuri interesante vorbesc..."

intrebarea aceasta decurge firesc in universul propriilor noastre asteptari, suntem curiosi si nerabdatori..dar... REALITATEA CONCRETA ne invata (daca stim sa ne aplecam asupra ei dincolo de superficilitatea noastra) ca este extrem de greu de a face descoperiri. Incerci pentru prima data in lume o chestie, nu stii peste ce dai, nu stii ce conditii sunt, ci doar INCERCI sa faci cat mai mult cu resursele materiale si de cunoastere de care dispui, si incerci sa fii cat mai sigur cu putinta in ceea ce faci, nu te hazardezi aiurea cu chestii in care s-a cheltuit enorm. De fapt, la alegerea locurilor unde au aterizat "roboteii" Spirit si Oportunity s-au facut mai multe planuri si s-au ales in final niste locatii cat mai convenabile pentru succesul misiunii (a fost o emisiune sau mai multe pe Discovery sau N geopgrafic, si cine a vazut, a putut intelege cat de dificil este).
Desigur, vrem sa ne explicam cutare anomalii sau cutare mistere. Cand si cum? Cu ce resurse? raspuns foarte plauzibil: in viitor, cu mare greutate. Sau poate SANSA ne ofera un noroc extraordinar sa aflam ceva cu adevarat deosebit. Ideea este ca dpdv al istoriei care se cladeste sub ochii nostri, noi suntem cu mult prea nerabdatori si neinformati despre realitate, asa ca este extrem de logic sa apara intrebarile "de ce" de ce nu", cum asa", nu cumva" etc..etc, si, evident, este la fel de logic ca aceste intrebari raman in principiu deocamdata fara raspuns indiferent cat ne-am zbate noi din scaunele noastre de privitori.

mai dau un exemplu: cazul "space debris" - tether incident si similare, expus pe alt topic. Pai daca alea sunt intr-adevar in realitate doar "space Debris", este oare de mirare ca NASA nu raspunde "la provocari" si nu tine discursuri publice de clarificare catre publicul deja "montat" pe ideea ca NASA minte. Demersul lor "uitati oameni buni, astea sunt space debris, si iata cum ce fel etc etc", ar fi inutil, si ar alimenta si mai mult senzationistii. In fond, oamenii de stiinta in ansamblu lor (nu haiducii!) pot intelege ce e cu acel fenomen, si nu mai e nevoie de explicatii la adresa acestora..cat despre omul de rand, cauza este pierduta, si oricum neimportanta in raport cu scopul exploratoriu in sine.


Desigur si Shadowman are in parte dreptate:

"Cred ca prima misiune cu echipaj uman care va ateriza pe
Marte ne va transmite aceasta stire...Nu ma astept sa gaseasca
pingiuni sau ursi polari pe cimpiile martiene...Insa un microorganism,
e foarte posibil...Chiar daca va fi un virus modificat genetic obtinut prin
laboratoarele terestre ! Se cheltuiesc sume enorme,care trebuiesc justificate...Plus sperante spulberate ale miliardelor de fani,publicitate,glorie,manipulari,fonduri de la buget pentru cercetari sau misiuni ulterioare...Teorii noi,simpozioane,conferinte,spectatori,talkshow-uri,vedete,etc...
Chiar daca vor apare teorii nastrusnice privind aparitia vietii pe Marte...! Gen : un meteorit sau asteroid a lovit Terra,fragmente cu gazon,furnici si virusi s-au ridicat la cer si ,printr-un concurs de imprejurari,a ajuns pe Marte...Unde virusii s-au adaptat si traiesc bine-merci !
"

pai da, cand anumite interese intervin, acestea sunt in stare de orice si corup orice. Daca este cu adevarat nevoie de a se sti ca e viata pe Marte (desi in realitate sa zicem ca nu ar fi), este posibil ca cineva puternic sa actioneze unde trebuie si astfel sa se demonstreze ca "e viata pe marte". Ca si cu E-urile din mancare: daca este nevoie sa se stie de popor ca cutare E este ne-nociv,  asa va fi ... pana la proba contrarie.

"Insa, daca vor descoperi urme ale unei civilizatii stravechi,nu se vor grabi
sa le aduca la cunostiinta publicului..."

eu nu as crede asta. De ce sa nu aduca la cunostinta publicului? (desigur, raspunsul este "teoria conspiratiei", deci mai bine nu intreb).

incerc sa spun ca a face un lucru deosebit in realitate, este mult mai greu si extraordinar decat credem noi ca este in imaginatia noastra, asa ca nu e de mirare aparitia povestilor si pretentiilor fara acoperire.

jackie a spus:

Miliarde de dolari pierduti pentru a gasi o bacterie, vierme sau putina iarba.

Nu-i asa ca omul este o fire curioasa?  :wink:

[jackie28t]

Am inteles acum ciuciulete.Esti un fan NASA.LOL :-)
Ai dreptate si ei muncesc di greu si o fac pentru binele omenirii numai ca deoarece NASA apartine guvernului American in caz de descoperiri trebuie mai intai sa se sorteze interesele militare dupa care resturile cu peisajele frumoase si bacteriile stralucitoare pot fi redate la stiri publicului in general.Ne minunam si aplaudam,invatam si descoperim pe langa asta platim si cotizatiile la stat.

[Shadowman]

incerc sa spun ca a face un lucru deosebit in realitate, este mult mai greu si extraordinar decat credem noi ca este in imaginatia noastra, asa ca nu e de mirare aparitia povestilor si pretentiilor fara acoperire.

  Si mie imi place sa traiesc in pace,sa fiu romantic,sa torn apa la flori ,sa cred ca oamenii sunt ingeri...
  Asta in interior...Cind iesi din "cochilie",  lovesti grinda si vezi pragul cu inscriptia:
  BINE AI VENIT IN REALITATE !
  Stii cind vom trai "epoca de aur" Ciuciulete...? Cind la bordul navetelor spatiale
vor zbura reporterii de la Antena 1,CNN sau OTV sa ne transmita in direct imagini de pe Marte...Chiar in direct nu vor fi ,ca sunt cam 100 de milioane de km pina acolo...Si undele vor sosi la receptoare mai tirziu..Deocamdata n-au zburat nici pina la Luna sa transmita ceva...Ar dura doar 1-2 secunde ca sa vedem in direct ! Cind in loc de Google Earth o sa butonez mouse-ul pe Google Moon...Ca se fac aproape 40 de ani de atunci si detaliile de pe Luna ( ce bine ar fi o transmisie in direct...!) sunt greu de gasit...Mai ales fata invizibila a Lunii...  Despre secretele misiunilor de la bordul navelor cosmice...?
  Un mic exemplu : http://www.jurnalul.ro/print.php?id=52363

P.S :Cit priveste programul Google Earth, iti amintesc ca nu sunt transmise  imagini in direct...

[xennon_2000]

Shad...esti cam realist (mult prea)....cand crezi u ca se va ajunge pe alte planete in alte sisteme solare!??????Tu nu crezi in aselenizare, nu?

[pri3st3ss]

Red Planet 'hiking maps' produced

Scientists using data from a European space probe orbiting Mars have produced new topographic maps of the Red Planet.
The "hiker's maps" provide detailed height contours and names of geological features on the Martian surface.
The European Space Agency (Esa), which compiled the maps, said it hoped the maps would become a standard reference for future research on the Red Planet.
The data, from the Mars Express spacecraft, has also been turned into 3-D models of the surface of Mars.
The topographic maps use contour lines to show the heights of the landscape.
The contour lines are superimposed upon high-resolution images of Mars, taken by the High-Resolution Stereo Camera (HRSC) aboard Mars Express.
The maps are much like those of Earth used by hikers and planning authorities.
The samples released by Esa show the Iani Chaos region of Mars because of its major topographical interest.
It is covered in individual blocks and hills that form a chaotic pattern across the landscape.
Mars Express entered orbit around the Red Planet in December 2003.


http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/6354991.stm

[xennon_2000]

Din poza astareiese ca a fost candva apa....aici!....Acum am auzit ca ar fi sub forma de gheata la poli sau sub scoarta!

[pri3st3ss]

Rocks reveal Mars' watery past

Exquisite colour images of the Martian surface give a tantalising glimpse into the Red Planet's watery past.
Shots of the deep valley Candor Chasma show light coloured areas of rock where water could have flowed.
These "haloes" surround fractures in the Martian bedrock which provide a promising target in the search for evidence of past life on the planet.

"It lends support to the idea that a substantial body of groundwater existed on Mars in the past and may still persist to the present day," said Professor Stephen Clifford of the Lunar and Planetary Institute in Houston, Texas.
"The fact that there is such persuasive evidence of joints and fractures in the crust also suggests that this groundwater had the ability to flow enormous distances."

Huge rift

The High Resolution Imaging Science Experiment (HiRise) camera started its surveys in November 2006, eight months after Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter (MRO) entered orbit around the Red Planet.
It is best known for capturing stunning images of Nasa's robot explorers Spirit and Opportunity as they surveyed the planet from the ground.

Nasa has recently admitted that some of the detectors on the camera are starting to fail.
The newly analysed images were taken last year. They show a snapshot of conditions in Candor Chasma, an area of the great Martian rift valley Valles Marineris.
This deep gash, the length of the United States, is up to seven times deeper than the Grand Canyon in places.
The images show a hilly landscape composed of alternating bands of light and dark coloured rock, suggesting the layers were deposited by regular cycles of water, wind or volcanic activity.

Writing in Science, the University of Arizona team said that similar features on Earth were "a clear indication of chemical interactions between fluids circulating within the fracture and the host rock".
Likely fluids include water, liquid carbon dioxide or a combination of the two, and may have flowed up from deep underground reservoirs.

Protected habitats

Previously, Europe's Mars Express mission had detected the signature of minerals altered by water in the Candor Chasma area.
The washed-out features, which have been "cemented" by minerals contained in the fluids, now stand proud from the valley walls.

They have been exposed by millions of years of erosion.
However, the fact that they were once underground has important implications for their ability to support life.
"The overlying areas of rock would have acted as a buffer against any harsh environmental conditions on Mars at that time," said Dr Chris Okubu of the University of Arizon and one of the authors on the paper.

"These areas would be nice protected areas for any biological processes to occur."

   

Erosion has uncovered rocks that were altered by the action of fluids

This is not the first time that scientists have found evidence of fluids upwelling from deep inside the Martian interior.
Last year, Nasa's Mars Global Surveyor (MGS) spacecraft spotted gullies and trenches thought to have been recently carved by outpourings of water or liquid carbon dioxide.
Other features, including dried-up lake beds, springs and river valleys, lend further weight to the theory that the planet was once awash with water and could therefore have supported life.
Nasa is examining all of these sites as possible targets for future ground-based robotic missions.
However, the space agency says that if it has a chance of finding evidence of life on the planet, it must broaden its search.
"Following the water is a central aspect of exploration but the habitability issue also requires addressing the source of energy for life," said Dr David des Marais of the Nasa Ames Research Center.
Possible future targets include areas of the planet where the building blocks of life, such as carbon, can be found.

"We not only need to follow the water but we also need to follow the energy," said Dr des Marais.
The MRO findings were presented at the American Association for the Advancement of Science (AAAS) annual meeting in San Francisco, US.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/6363243.stm



pt 1: Light-toned layered rock in Mars' Becquerel Crater. Layers show cyclic changes in thickness. The areas coloured blue are sand dunes. (Image: Science)

pt 2 :Colourful rock layers can be seen in a small valley of the Mawrth Vallis channel system. Clay-like minerals can be found in this region, which probably formed in the presence of water. (Image: Science)

pt 3:The upper-most layers of rock in areas of Valles Marineris, Mars, have been stripped away by erosion, providing a glimpse of the subsurface. (Image: Science)

[xennon_2000]

Nu stim daca a fost sau nu viata pe marte dar putem stii sigur ca se poate coloniza aceasta planeta!Apa are, oxigen suficient pentru fotosinteza, bioxid da carbon din belsug pentru plante, soare...doar acel  imbold dat de om mai trebuie! :wink:

[pri3st3ss]

Movies provide new view of Mars



Two animations released by Nasa allow viewers to "hang-glide" over the terrain currently being explored by the US space agency's Mars rovers.
The animations were created using pictures taken by the Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter (MRO).
MRO used its HiRise camera to take images of the same site from different angles over several orbits.
This provided the 3D mapping data needed to animate a flypast over the Red Planet.
The animations were created to support the twin robotic rovers, Spirit and Opportunity, in their ongoing explorations of the Red Planet.

The movies reveal the geology of the Columbia Hills, which are being explored by Spirit, and Victoria Crater, where Opportunity is currently based, in exquisite detail.
And they provide an impressive display of MRO's capabilities, backed up by the most powerful camera ever sent to Mars.



Topographical maps

"Victoria Crater, which is 750 to 800m (2,460 to 2,624ft) across is on the Meridiani Plains, which are very flat, so there is very little to see. But parts of the crater are very steep and it's all very challenging when comparing the images," said Randolph Kirk, from the United States Geological Survey (USGS) in Flagstaff, Arizona.

"The high quality of the HiRise data really wins out, and allows us to do things we've never done in this area with other cameras."

   
He added: "The Columbia Hills, in contrast, is a more typical area of Mars. There is an incredible amount of detail at the scale of metres that we've never been able to see topographically."

The movies were created using commercial software used to map the Earth with airborne and satellite data.
This software matches points on pairs of images taken from different angles and determines their elevation in order to construct a topographic map.
Dr Kirk said the animations show what one might see if they were hang-gliding over the Martian surface.




puteti urmari niste filmulete aici :  http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/6449031.stm ( apasati pe imagini )

[pri3st3ss]

Polar water 'would blanket Mars'



Enough water is locked up at Mars' south pole to cover the planet in a liquid layer 11m (36ft) deep.

The Mars Express probe used its radar instrument to map the thickness of Mars' south polar layered deposits.
Analysis of the Marsis radar data shows that the polar deposits consist of almost pure water-ice.
The findings appear in the journal Science and were also presented this week at the Lunar and Planetary Science Conference in Houston, Texas.
It was known by the 1970s that the north and south polar regions of the Red Planet were blanketed by thick accumulations of layered material.
Based upon data from the Mariner and Viking projects, the polar layered deposits were considered to be accumulations of dust and ice.



Deep and wide

Today, polar layered deposits hold most of the known water on Mars, though other areas of the planet appear to have been very wet at times in the past. The south polar layered deposits alone are the size of the US state of Texas.
Understanding where the water went is considered crucial to knowing whether the Red Planet could once have supported life.

The layered deposits cover an area similar to the US state of Texas
The Mars Advanced Radar for Subsurface and Ionospheric Sounding (Marsis) consists of two 20m-long (65ft) hollow fibreglass "dipole" booms to make a primary antenna.

It sends out pulses of radio waves from the antenna to the planet's surface and analyses the time delay and strength of the waves that return.
Analysis of those waves that penetrate the soil and bounce back will give information on transitions between materials with different electrical properties, such as rock and liquid water, beneath the Martian surface.

The instrument gathered data on the south polar region over the course of about 300 orbits of Mars Express.

It was able to reach through the icy layers to the lower boundary, which can be as deep as 3.7km (2.3 miles) below the surface.



Pure water

The radar penetrated through the chaotic, lumpy deposits with very little attenuation (reduction in signal strength), suggesting they were almost 90% water-ice; the rest being dust.
The radar cannot tell whether there is carbon dioxide mixed in with the water-ice, but lead author Jeff Plaut told BBC News that the thickness of the ice also pointed to a composition of nearly pure frozen water.
Researchers traced the base of the south polar layered deposits and found a set of buried depressions within 300 km of the pole that may be ancient impact craters.
"We didn't really know where the bottom of the deposit was," Dr Plaut, from the US space agency's (Nasa) Jet Propulsion Laboratory in California, explained.

"We can see now that the crust has not been depressed by the weight of the ice as it would be on Earth.

"The crust and upper mantle of Mars are stiffer than the Earth's, probably because the interior of Mars is so much colder."

One area with an especially bright reflection from the base of the deposits posed a puzzle for the researchers. It resembled what a thin layer of liquid water might look like to radar, but the conditions are so cold that the presence of melted water was considered highly unlikely.
The radar was successfully deployed in June 2005, after a delay of more than a year amid concerns that the booms might swing back and damage the spacecraft.


fig 1 :  Map showing the thickness of Mars' south polar layered ice deposits(purple represents the thinnest areas; red the thickest). The dark circle is an area where data could not be collected.



Cave entrances' spotted on Mars

Scientists studying pictures from Nasa's Odyssey spacecraft have spotted what they think may be seven caves on the surface of Mars.
The candidate caves are on the flanks of the Arsia Mons volcano and are of sufficient depth their floors mostly cannot be seen through the opening.
Details were presented here at the Lunar and Planetary Science Conference in Houston, Texas.

Temperature data from Mars Odyssey's Themis instrument support the idea.

The authors say that the possible discovery of caves on the Red Planet is significant.
The caves may be the only natural structures capable of protecting primitive life forms from micrometeoroids, UV radiation, solar flares and high energy particles that bombard the planet's surface.
The spacecraft spotted what seemed to be vertical "skylight" entrances to caves below the surface.
There is a sheer drop of between about 80m and 130m or more to the cave floors below.


'Seven sisters'

During the day, one of the features - nicknamed "Annie" - is warmer than surrounding pits and cooler than sunlit areas.
Night time temperatures are warmer than nearly all surrounding areas.

Co-author Glen Cushing, from the US Geological Survey in Flagstaff, Arizona, said this was exactly what would be expected if the feature were a cave.

"Nothing like these features has been seen elsewhere on Mars," he told BBC News.
The researchers describe the candidate caves as "seven sisters" and have given them all names: Dena, Chloe, Wendy, Annie, Abbey, Nicki and Jeanne.
The cave entrances are between 100m and 252m wide (330-828ft).
Becaue in most cases the cave floors cannot be seen, only minimum depths are known: the researchers calculated they must extend between 73m and 96m (240-315ft) below the surface.
However, in one image taken of Dena by the Mars Odyssey Camera, a floor can be seen.
Using the data, the authors calculated that this cave must extend 130m (426ft) below the surface.
Mars Odyssey was launched in April 2001 to hunt for past or present water on the Red Planet.
Its Themis (Thermal Emission Imaging System) instrument uses the visible and infrared part of the electromagnetic spectrum to measure the temperature properties of the Martian surface.




Frozen sea may harbour Mars life

A frozen sea found on Mars is one of the most promising places to look for life on the Red Planet, scientists say.

But planned missions designed to search for microbes below the Martian surface will not drill deep enough to find living cells, the UK team has said.
Researchers at University College London say that microbes in the first couple of metres of Martian soil would be killed off by intense radiation.

Life might survive deeper down, where conditions are more benign, they think.    
It just isn't plausible that dormant life is still surviving in the near-subsurface of Mars

Lewis Dartnell, UCL
But these depths were beyond the reach of drills envisaged for missions to Mars, said Lewis Dartnell, from UCL's Centre for Mathematics and Physics in the Life Sciences & Experimental Biology (Complex).
These missions - such as Europe's ExoMars rover - could find hints that life once existed there - such as proteins, DNA fragments or fossils, explained Mr Dartnell; and that "would be a major discovery in itself".
But he added: "The Holy Grail for astrobiologists is finding a living cell that we can warm up, feed nutrients and reawaken for study.
"It just isn't plausible that dormant life is still surviving in the near-subsurface of Mars - within the first couple of metres below the surface - in the face of the ionizing radiation field.
"Finding life on Mars depends on liquid water surfacing on Mars, but the last time liquid water was widespread on Mars was billions of years ago."



Survival times

The study, published in the journal Geophysical Research Letters, maps out the likely cosmic radiation levels at various depths, taking into account different surface conditions on Mars.
Unlike Earth, Mars is not protected by a global magnetic field or thick atmosphere and for billions of years it has been laid bare to radiation from space.
Can Europe's rover drill deep enough to find life?
Mr Dartnell's calculations suggest survival times near the surface reach only a few million years. This would mean that the chance of finding life with the planned probes is slim.
Scientists would need to dig deeper and target very specific, hard-to-reach areas such as recent craters or areas where water has recently surfaced.
The research suggested that one of the best places to look for living cells on Mars would be within the frozen sea in Mars' near-equatorial Elysium region.
This is because the ice is relatively recent - it is believed to have surfaced in the last five million years - and so has been exposed to radiation for a relatively short amount of time.


Icy secrets

Water provides an ideal shield of hydrogen to protect life on Mars from destructive cosmic radiation particles.

Ice also holds an advantage because it is far easier to drill through than rock.
But, even here, surviving cells might be out of the reach of proposed drills. Other ideal sites include recent craters, because their surfaces have been exposed to less radiation, and the gullies recently discovered in the sides of some of these craters, as they are thought to have flowed with water in the last five years.
The discovery of a vast frozen sea just below the Martian surface was announced by scientists in 2005.

Their assessment was based on pictures from Europe's Mars Express that showed plated and rutted features across an area 800km by 900km.
John Murray, from the Open University, Jan-Peter Muller, from UCL, and others said a catastrophic event probably flooded the landscape five million years ago. The floodwaters then froze out and were covered with dust or ash, they argue.
Some researchers point to the lack of "ground truth" about the radiation environment on Mars' surface to assess life's chances there.



fig 2 : 3D images of pack ice near the Martian equator have been taken by the High Resolution Stereo Camera on board the Mars Express probe. The detected ground features are reminiscent of fractured ice floes on Earth. (Image: Esa/DLR/Berlin/Neukum)

[Unidentified]

pri3st3ss vad ca te atrage Marte ... imi place si mie sa mai aud stiri legate de Marte si alti astrii in general.Citeam undeva ca pe Marte ar exista si vegetatie ,cu copaci si alte minunatii,afirmatii sprijinite de poze f interesante.Cert este ca o sa aflam din ce in ce mai multe lucruri despre planetele care ne inconjoara ,multe dintre ele rescriind istoria.  :planet:

[CHIP]

Interesanta este declaratia lui HORACE CRATER(specialist in fizica moleculara teoretica si expert mondial in transformarea structurilor de date experimentale in forme matematice,din care pot fi deduse alte structuri)si care a inceput cercetari in legatura cu constructiile de pe Marte inca din anul 1993.Acesta afirma ca ,,Am fost uimit de ceea ce am gasit.Aranjarea lor nu a fost naturala,,

[Leonard]

Da sar fi putut exista vitza pe marte dar inca nasa ascunde multe.Pe marte exista inca ghiatza la poli.Poate in vitorul in ideprtat nu se stie. :rocket:

[CHIP]

pt.Leonard:
Mai mult decit atit se presupune ca ar exista apa sub scoarta terestra a lui Marte.Poate ca viitorul va demonstra acest lucru.
Cu privire la faptul ca N.A.S.A. minte cu privire la dovezile gasite ,retine urmatoarele:N.A.S.A. nu este ceva de genul nava spatiala ENTERPRISE intr-o misiune de cautare a unor lumi si civilizatii noi,de a patrunde unde nimeni nu a patruns vreodata.Dimpotriva este copilul problema provenit din parinti disfunctionali -paranoia si razboiul.S-a format in 1958,in plin razboi rece,cind toate progresele din stiinta spatiala erau produsul secundar al inventarii unor arme mai eficiente.Explorarea spatiului este in legatura directa cu politica de aparare si inca mai predomina mentalitatea din timpul razboiului rece.Desi este finantata din taxe publice aceasta nu raspunde in fata oamenilor,ci in fata guvernului american.Nici o lege nu o obliga sa furnizeze informatii publicului larg.In sectiunea 102(c) din actul din 29 iulie 1958(Actul Spatial),prin care a luat nastere N.A.S.A. se prevede ca:
Informatiile obtinute sau create in exercitarea functiilor sale prevazute in acest act vor fi puse la dispozitia publicului,cu exceptia:
a. Informatiilor autorizate si cerute de statutul federal a ramane secrete
b.informatiilor clasate pentru a proteja siguranta nationala
Si atunci ce ar mai fi de comentat?

[sxn_b]

Am gasit pe nasa.gov o imagine mai clara a fetei de pe Marte.
http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/image/0704/MRO-GS-vantuyne.jpg